Where the hell is the President. Does he understand what is going on or does he just not cate????

Ya know...that's been my question too. Where is Obama? Why isn't he speaking up about all the @!$%# that the repugs are doing around the country? I understand that, policy wise, there is little that the Feds can do with respect to a state's autonomy, but still...he could speak up, couldn't he?

Besides that...some of the crap being passed around some of the states with regards to voters rights and womens rights, just seems to me that some of this IS unconstitutional.

Are the repugs just wanting a fight? Or are they trying to ram thru as much garbage as they can because they know they will lose the coming elections?

And these questions do not answer the most pressing one.....

Mr. President...where are you? Why aren't you standing up for us? I know you're busy and have lots of things going on at once, and it's probably difficult to pay attention to all of the different rights that each state is currently trampling underfoot; but if they [repubs] succeed in enacting half the crap they are trying for, there will be no one left to stand up for you.

Obama seems to think that Republicans (meaning, Republican politicians) are reasonable people, and that if you are polite to them and adopt practically every one of their nihilistic, subversive, seditious and treasonous policies, then they will play nice and toss the country a dog biscuit.

But the only way to deal with all of this is to confront the GOP and fight them tooth and claw. It's not as if they're straining much to hide their real agenda any more, so why aren't national Democrats really opening up on them? They keep reaching out their hands and the Republicans keep hacking them off with machetes. You'd think the Democrats would have gotten the message by now.

As far as voter suppression goes, the only thing left for the Republican state governments to do now is to compel everyone to re-register to vote using new forms which have just two options for political affiliation: "Republican" and "I hereby renounce now and forever my privilege to vote in any election whatsoever."

Funny you should say that. Obama apparently thinks the same way about our enemies in the middle east! Just be nice to them....

It is naive!

Nothing wrong with expecting people to be American citizens.

I suggest you have no clear notion of what Obama thinks of "enemies" in the Middle East...just more regurgitated right wing, red neck Republican talking point.

I'll bet you think OBL is still alive too?

He's really nice to the middle east? And here I had thought OBL was killed and we were at a new war w/ Libya. Le sighs. C'mon Katy at least try to keep up.

Katy is busy reporting my profile to the moderators...

Le sigh

The number one missin of NASA is to make muslims proud of what they contributed to science and technology.....come'on.

Any 2 year old could see through this nonsense!

@Katy...WTF? NASA...Muslims? What did I miss? This has to do with voter ID in WI how?

Katy, I am getting tired of asking you this....What the f**k are you blathering about?

You have a real knack for spewing off topic. My crystal ball tells me that there is a troll underfoot. (Sniff...sniff) Yep....smells like troll.

Katy loves it when she pisses you off. I don't mean to be rude here, but the fact that she got under your skin will tickle her to death. That's how she is. To that extent yes she is a troll. To the extent that she will just keep spouting the same idea over and over no. Sometimes she can be persuaded- if only because she gets bored when she realizes she no longer has an effect on you. Just remember that the more you're bothered the happier she is. I understand completely how bothered you are (I've been there myself so many gorram times) I'm just trying to help you to the knowledge that I've learned. She isn't here for debate. She is here to feed off the anxiety she gives you. The way you defeat her, quite honestly, is from ignoring her. To be fair to you- I fell for it yet again like the stupid idiot I am by responding to her and her NASA comment. It is my fault that I gave her a platform. I was the idiot in this case. Please learn from my stupidities and save yourself the hassel- you are worth more! ;-)

I really don't get it...is it like...a mistake and meaning to post on a different thread on several different occasions??

The troll smell Cyn...I don't know how that manages to be so pervasive and yet so...untouchable?

Does anyone have a theory here? How does this happen day after day?

but the fact that she got under your skin will tickle her to death.

That may work in my favor.

She isn't here for debate.

Mickey...I hear you...I feel you...I understand. The gloves are off...she cannot go toe to toe with me...she's reported me for my profile...of all things....I'm just saying...I do this now with a smile on my face. There may indeed be some sort of pathology there...but...I am just working on a different approach.

Just remember that the more you're bothered the happier she is.

I get that...and I embrace it. Bring it... bothered is not what I am.

Mickey...I don't ever see any of your posts as rude...I dig the truth...you bring that....even when it smacks me upside my head.... ;)

I must have missed your NASA comment...*shrug

Oh no she brought up NASA's primary missin [sic] is to hire Muslims. And I stupidly commented back to her. What I'm saying is I was wrong. What Katy is worth is the /ignore button. You are far too smart a person @Maggie and @Cyncerity to fall for her crap. The fact that I did should show you how much of a moron I am lol. Damn. I just ripped myself. Anywho- that's what I was going off of. You ultimately make your own decisions and I'm not meaning to boss you or bully you. But I am telling you yeah if you're looking for an honest debate she 9:10 is not willing to put up for one. This is where I personally get frustrated w/ blogging. I look forward to discussing ideas to make our country better. I neither love yes men (as the saying is) nor do I want to constantly be a stickler in people's eye. I simply want to share ideas and the hopes I have personally is that I grow from that experience. I believe most of you are smarter than I am (this would apply to @Maggie and @Cyncerity, ftr) and I feel like if we talk about things I can learn from you. Katy does not share in that spirit. If that's what you came here for, unfortunately, she is definitely not the person to share in such ideology.

Also FTR I wasn't meaning to make a personal statement on either @Maggie or @Cyncerity. I was trying to make my comments broad enough for everyone and I apologize sincerely for not coming across that way. I don't want anyone to waste their time on someone who isn't worth it. Not w/ how much intellect and talent...that's like saying I'd want you washing cars instead of being a lawyer if you're really good at law. It'd just cruel =)

Hey Mouser...no worries...stop beating yourself up. ;) I definitely appreciate the insight. I figured Katy for a @!$%#-stirrer but like you, I couldn't help myself. ;)

Sometimes we just have to walk out into the pasture in order to smell the bull@!$%#, ya know? ;)

Maggie....you go grrl....get them claws out and start rippin'....

I believe most of you are smarter than I am (this would apply to @Maggie and @Cyncerity

Ahh...hell no...not buying that...you write so eloquently and are so well versed on so many issues...we gotta disagree there with the smarts... :) I have been reading you and Uffy...esp. for some time now...and "tell ya whut" it's really good stuff come from ya'll's keyboards.

I feel like if we talk about things I can learn from you

Ditto that sentiment....and you are again correct...Katy is here to fight...she has no interest in sharing or learning...she's all about @!$%# Obama...@!$%# the left and all Democrats...period. It's a well perceived agenda.

Here's the deal...she used my kids....to get under my skin...Tyler gave her a pass and me a week suspension because I gave her what she deserved and fully violated the COH...I own that. Cooler heads prevail with time off eh?

It's just one of those things where I'm like "why the hell do I fall for this when I know their game?" I want desperately to believe everyone has good intentions....it literally hurts me to know that, that isn't true. The truth is there's only a handful of conservatives/Republicans who blog here who are actually interested in debate. Everyone else is just trying to rattle your cage...I guess cause it bothers them so much that you don't conform? Which raises my question of why anti-conformity is seen as so bad amongst those who profess to be the most anti-conformist??? Ayn Rand talked about anti-conformity all the time; yet those who follow her are the most vitriolic to those whom do not follow her? Can they not see their own hypocrisy? I just...honest to bleeping god I am too stupid to understand the hypocrisy...I really am.

I do NOT condone what she said about your children FTR Maggie. I was know I didn't e-mail you back, but I was literally so mad I couldn't articulate my feelings. I am sorry that it came across that way since we're interwebs friends, but I was just...I still am....it's just...grrrrrrrrr

Mouser...I agree with Maggie. You are much more versed in some of the issues than I am. I enjoy your posts. I read your stuff, then I go look it up. ;)

Maggie...what is COH? And you got booted off for a week cuz of Katy? Ugh....she just went to the top of my poopie list.

Cyn Katy has no respect for people I just...gawd now I'm thinking about what she said to @maggie and...no I can't...jlkj;lskjd;fkja;slkfjldkslkjfsjp;fasd if that makes any gorram sense. I just want...no I can't say that...just...just...it's not bleeping OK ok???? It's not bleeping OK to do that. I just....grrr

This here is why I never said a gorram thing because there are some instances where I can't keep my composure and in this case I cannot....in this case it hits a nerve (which I know I know Katy LOVES to hear) and I cannot help but be upset by it...the only rebuttal I have is please remember that 1 in every 100 persons is classified as a sociopath and 1 in every 80 is classified as a narcissist.

Mickey...try not to forget the infirmed...and the pathology that exists here.

Even better...

"The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me."
— Ayn Rand

Moreover...

"Do not let your fire go out, spark by irreplaceable spark in the hopeless swaps of the not-quite, the not-yet, and the not-at-all. Do not let the hero in your soul perish in lonely frustration for the life you deserved and have never been able to reach. The world you desire can be won. It exists.. it is real.. it is possible.. it's yours."
— Ayn Rand (Atlas Shrugged)

Peace...

See this is why I love you @Maggie...honest to G-O-D you are one of my heroes...it's because of this

Cyn...the COH is the Code of Honor by which we must all abide by here.

http://www.newsvine.com/_nv/cms/info/codeOfHonor

What can I say...sometimes you are the bug...sometimes you are the windshield :)

Mickey's post's just in general rock...I read every word...and sometimes I am there...and sometimes I need to look up stuff to stay with that flow.

Note to Mick....I dont' YES person anyone... If you sucked...I'd tell ya that too. :)

Mickey...it's all good...ditto...ditto and yeah...

Hey...how about our former Governator...lol.... Republican wonder-kind. Oh just shoot me... right this is about Wisconsin...sorry I am in CA.

Maggie

The woman is a a sociopath pure and simple. I posted what I thought of her behavior then I haven't replied to her for months because of it. Look what happened. I replied to you and I got suspended for a day. I expect I'll be suspended or banned just for posting this.

I'm in California too Maggie. The former Gov. Oi! There is another sociopath for you!

Mean!

Yes

Mean and Merciless.

My brother said to me, he wondered what would be done about the increase of Hispanics at the polls. I agree. With more non whites voting, its only a matter of time before they have proper representation at state and federal levels!

They are trying to pick a fight, to provoke people to not just protest, but riot or revolution. Then they can justify going wild destroying civil rights and completely handing over power to the corporations. They are looking for a "Reichstag moment" to justify a Wisconsin version of Kristallnacht.

I guess that means that its up to us, we the people to keep voters refreshed about what we're all fighting for. This fight is all of ours. ONE NATION! UNITED!!!

Voter repression is one of the 14 Tenets of Fascism. Just sayin.

What next, total totalitarianism?

It has to be total totalitarianism...otherwise it would be semi- or demitarianism, or maybe half-assarianism.

We are already had totalitarianism for 8 years and now there is an attempt for it to continue, but it would appear that the masses are not as dumb or scared as they were before, like after 9/11.

The masses seem to be seeing through the smoke and mirrors that is the republicansconservativeteabaggerdinosores....

Perhaps it is that the younger generation is finding out that you cannot protest by e-mail, twitter etc... you know high tech means. LOL

Tweeting and e-mailing your politican/representative does not work..... as they do not have to acknowledge they received them, and as the media cannot show what they can't see....... LOL

Low tech like marching and bodies massing, like the boomers (gasp) did works better.....LOL

Who knew that grandma and grandpa and even the mater and pater knew something that the younguns... did not know...LOL

This group of Seniors knew that the way to get the attention of the country is to see the masses...... warts and all.....across the TV screen. Wasn't that the reason that the Vietnam war came to an end?

Although the treatment of the soldiers returning home from Nam, was not right or fair, as they were drafted and did not have a choice about going or not.

Since the 1980s we have had 20 years of totalitarianism imo..... 12years of Reaganism, 4 years of senior Bushisms and then 8 years of Bush/Cheneyisms...... Or perhaps it was total twitsntwatsisms..... LOL

I'am saying the gloves are coming off. No more wine and soft jazz. Just put out, and shut up! I'am saying no more sweet talking, or lying about who they are. Soon they will give us the truth. How will they do this you ask? By changing the way we vote and pass laws in this country. I do believe total totalitarianism is still to come!

Does anyone have any stats on the number of voter eligible people that don't already have some sort of photo identification. I am not being sarcastic - it's just that whenever this topic comes up people always equate voter photo IDs as supressing Dem voters. That would imply that people that vote Republican almost always have photos and those that vote Democratic dont't. And people will point out that the reason is that the poor and elderly usually vote Democrat and those groups have large numbers without photos and/or have a disadvantage of obtaining them if they don't. I have in the past suggested having free photos when a person registers to vote because it does seem to me that no one has a problem registering to vote, it is just the photo part of it. There must be some reliable stats out there on this.

We had a Voter ID bill pass in Indiana and fail a lawsuit challenge, which opened the floodgates for the rest of the country.

The real issues is that it's a law without a reason. How much voter fraud is committed and has been revealed which has created a necessity for this law? NONE. How much voter fraud has been prevented by the Voter ID bills? NONE.

The Voter ID bill in Indiana seems to be more watered down and did not have crazy provisions that are found elsewhere, too.

I don't know if there are statistics on the number of people without photo IDs out there, but I found Rachel's guest last night to have a very interesting point: the kind of vote fraud that photo IDs would prevent is extremely rare, where a person actually shows up at a polling station to vote when they aren't eligible. As she pointed out, it does nothing to prevent voter fraud in absentee ballots, for example. How do you know that the ballot that came from a soldier serving overseas is really from that soldier? In the 2000 election, if I recall correctly, FL allowed a bunch of absentee military ballots to be counted, despite the fact that they were either not dated, arrived after the date allowed, or were missing witness signatures.

Election fraud is a far more serious problem, especially with voting machines that run on proprietary codes that no one is allowed to see, manufactured by a company that gives lots of money to repubs, and don't even have a requirement to print out a paper receipt that could be used by a voter to verify their vote was counted accurately, and that could be used in the case of a recount. Yet nothing is done about this real threat to fair and honest elections.

Good points Uffdaguy. How can the election fraud issues be dealt with? The new voting machines do pose the problem of no paper trail, so maybe we have to go down the old fashioned way of paper ballots. It would take longer to tally, but lately with all the contested elections it would probably be shorter. I fear that we will probably have even bigger problems if we try internet voting - anyone could be on a keyboard in a private residence "pulling the lever". This may be a case where new technologies are not the way to go.

I personally would love to see us go "backwards" to paper ballots, not just because it provides solid evidence of voter intent, but would also slow the whole process down, which I think would be a good thing. We have seen a number of instances where news organzations have reported a "winner" with few, if any votes actually counted. How can anyone have any real faith in an election system where you can declare a winner with no actual votes counted?

Paper ballots are just as susceptible to voter fraud. The real control over voter fraud is done at the precinct level. When I vote in my suburban precinct, I don't know the judges, but they look at my ID and my signature. Yet there are no charges of voter fraud. The Republicans fear large turnouts in big cities like Milwaukee and they will have judges in each precinct challenging every voter. The law is not really intended for areas outside the cities and I doubt whether it will be strictly enforced outside of the cities. Dems need to be ready with attorneys and election official for these Republican election judges. You have to beat them at their own game before the Republicans will stop trying. Voter suppression worked in Florida and it is imperative for Dems to overcome these voting obstacles.

When I vote I have to sign my name in the voters register. I have never been asked for ID, but I suspect there might be some question raised if my signature was not fairly close to the last several which are also recorded in the same book. In order for someone to commit voter fraud and vote in my name, she would have to replicate my signature. What is the chance of that happening?

If there have been times that even the voting centers cannot accommodate the amount of voters lined up to vote then .... can one imagine the awful crush that will be at the DMV... short staffed as they are.....

The DMV departments throughout the various States are going to have to hire more employees to do these photo IDs...... The passport offices are already swamped... so..... hmmm

Talk about trying to increase the size of government..... LOL

There is no perfect voting system, but some are far more imperfect than others. The electronic voting machines that have proprietary software we can't see, that are easily hacked, leave no paper trail, and are manufactured by a major repub donor are easily the worst of the worst.

Easier said than done Mr. Paganucci. People often change for money, and the real money is had by the few. In our case, the Republican few.

The electronic voting machines that have proprietary software...and are manufactured by a major repub donor are easily the worst of the worst.

I smell an opportunity in that for someone in developing free open-source voting software to run on those $100 laptops.

I can't wait to hear the Republicans howl when Dems are in control and do the same things.

If only they had the guts to do the same things.

SC is a "preclearance" state under Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act of 1965, so this voter ID law must be approved by the US Justice Department before it can go into effect.

I read an article a week or two ago that said it would cost $6B to implement this program and only catch about 0.0003% of the problems.

Ah! The penny wise, pound foolish Conservative agenda at work. It's alright to spend as long as it's for what their vision of the world is.

Correction from above: $6M; went back to look up the link: http://tinyurl.com/43pu2mg

Then someone should introduce voting by mail for all. No need for an ID then.

FromDownHere

Don't you & your wife sign the voter register when you vote? Every time I vote here in California (save one) I give my name and address and the polling people look me up to verify I am registered to vote and am resident and then I sign which is proof I voted.

The only time that I didn't was my name was not on the polling register. Not even on the hand written last minute add tos. I showed a valid ID showing I was a resident I had to vote on a provisional ballot. That why I think the whole voter ID requirement is plain stupid Having an ID doesn't mean a person can vote. It does nothing about voter fraud period. It is a waste of taxpayers' time and money.

Maria,

Thanks, you know I hadn't really thought of it but you are right.

So why is requiring an ID such a big deal? I guess there are many that have no ID? I live in a state that has a large immigrant population and those I know, legal or not, when they don't drive get an ID from the DMV so they can cash checks, be carded for beer or cigarettes, or carded for gaming. We live in a society that ID is required in many instances. Not trying to argue but I don't know who you are protecting. People that are in this country without an ID? huh?

FDH

I live in a state that has a huge immigrant population. The largest Chinese population outside of China. The largest Mexican population outside of Mexico. Most of them are here legally. I am not protecting anyone. I am saying having ID doesn't guarantee the right to vote. It doesn't prove a person is a citizen. It's a waste of money. And I don't think you're arguing with me. Just please understand things are different in different states. Friends? :-)

I'm with ya

And you are right, it is a waste of money with the safeguards already in place

Friends

FDH

I'm glad we're friends. As a postscript, the other day I had to pull out my driver's licence. I noticed on the back in very teeny tiny (as Rachel would say) writing. It stated the following:

"This Licence is issued as a licence to drive a motor vehicle; it does not establish eligibility for employment, voter registration, or public benefits"

Yeah we do things differently here in California. ;-)

@Choctaw Charlie - It is going backwards because it took years of reform to eliminate artificial obstacles to voting by minorities. They are simply reinstating the under the guise of a solution to a proble that does not exist.

Not proving that the vote you cast is exactly the same as the way the machine recorded it kills democracy, my friend.

Again Choctaw (sorry I misspelled your name last time) what are these "qualifications" you speak of?

(Sorry I didn't edit in time) Because as far as I know thee only "qualifications" needed to vote are: 1)Be an American citizen 2) Be 18 years old or older 3) Have not been convicted of a felony

Having ID won't change that. Pepole who are American citizens can get an ID. People who are under 18 years old can get an ID. People who have been convicted of a felony can get an ID. Showing an ID to vote doesn't mean a thing. It's useless.

Choctaw, the state verifies eligibility when voters register. At least that is how it works where I live.

Maria,

You are correct with the exception of No. 3. Each State has different laws with regard to felons and voting. A few completely disallow it while some allow felons to vote while serving time in prison. Most allow one to vote once the period of probation, parole or incarceration has been completed.

For a detailed listing of what each State's laws are, visit http://www.ncsl.org/default.aspx?tabid=16529

mgavery

You're right and I realized that driving home last night. Silly me. Thanks for the correction.

Yeah, you get all that fascism and all that nonsense.

Charlie - you have no power here, be gone before someone drops a house on you too !

@Uffda...I am absolutely LOVING your little quid pro quos with Charlie. Truly inspiring. ;)

Wit without measure...you are my new hero. ;)

Unfortunately, you are having a battle of wits with an unarmed person....so I am not sure how fair that is. ;)

Thanks, Cyn. I'm not sure where this new guy came from, but it seems that all he can do is spout one-line talking points, no doubt cribbed from some right wing site. I'd be very happy to debate him on voter fraud vs. election fraud, but I know that's something repubs don't want to get into. The Wizard doesn't like it when you tug on the curtain!

Hey...what happened to all of Charlie's posts? they are all deleted. Did he do that?

I think deleting our own posts should be an option, but I suppose then we could get away with "temporary" mud slinging. *sigh

LOL Maggie...I agree...I've tried to delete mine before because I figured I'd better not publish what I was writing but had to just delete all the words except for some random symbol. ;) So much for mud-slinging. ;) *Le sigh*

Agreed. Careful tho, that veers dangerously close to the "gun control only keeps guns from lawful citizens" argument.