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BP says it's waiting to see whether the top kill it started yesterday is working to plug the Deepwater Horizon. As of last night, BP said that what appears to be coming out of the Gulf of Mexico well now is drilling mud and not oil. It's a hopeful sign, anyway.
While we're all waiting and hoping and praying and getting madder and madder, consider a report from Deja Vu Land. In June 1979, an oil rig called the Ixtoc I blew up in the Gulf of Mexico. Amazingly, the sad and sorry tale of the Ixtoc oil disaster involves many of the same players and the same desperate techniques for stanching the oil gushing into the Gulf. Rachel Maddow:
The oil companies keep talking about how technologically advanced they are, but what they have gotten technologically advanced at is drilling deeper. They haven't gotten any more advanced on how to deal with the risks attached to that. They haven't made any technological advances in the last 30 years when it comes to stopping a leak like this when it happens.
All they've gotten better at is making the risks worse, by putting these leaks further out of our reach. Wow, hey, congratulations. Now the thing you can't stop is a full mile underwater. That and making themselves the most profitable industry the universe has ever seen, and I am not exaggerating.
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Dear Rachel,
Great show last night.
You highlighted a historical perspective that is simply incredible.
Historical memory is something that is all but absent in the American media.
Please keep hammering away with the history of oil spills.
If we can't even remember recent history, how can we ever change.
The collective memory of America is so minuscule that anything you can do to remind people of events leading to our current circumstances is a great service.
More history please!
Great job Rachel!
You rock!
Sincerely,
JTN
Sources, hatenomor?
Well then, you'd be guilty as sin.
Disgusting!! Big Oil has not even attempted to learn from the spill in 1979!!
PS Rachel, Gravitas White Guy Anchor is none other then the Late, Great, Floyd Kakber http://www.floydkalber.com/
"Gravitas white guy anchor?" I was shocked and disgusted to see this come from Rachel. I can understand the jab at the Ted Baxter style of 1979 but "white guy"? Ugh.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
It means whatever he wants it to from one moment to the next, just like Nazi, Socialist, etc.
It wasn't racist any more than it was sexist, but I admit it did puzzle me just a little to wonder if I'd heard it wrong, but I suppose that in '79 they didn't exactly have much of anything else but 'white guy' anchors. Arguably, there's still a bit of a problem with the racial aspect.
PS to my previous comment @hatenomor -- name 3.
In re: to his reply, thank you for demonstrating that you do in fact not know what it means. And no, we're not working towards a color blind society (BTW, your placing that in quotes belies your true feelings about it, sort of like sarcasm), we're working towards a cat-like society: we see color, we just don't give a crap. You strike me as someone who wants a quote color blind society unquote, so that you don't get called out on it, so that nobody suspects any of your true feelings; you want it as a cover, playing the reverse race card, i.e., you're either projecting or disassociating.
Ironically the white woman accurately described the white man as a white man ... get off it already and grow up.
The point of the story is that in 31 years the oil companies have improved their technology to drill from 200 feet to 5,000 feet below the surface, yet have not improved nor apparently altered they crisis management strategies, techniques, or preparations for the exact same emergency being experienced today.
The entire situation smacks of brutal incompetence on the part of those responsible for crisis response planning, maintaining the blow-out preventor in working order, making good workplace decisions about in-the-moment warning signs, and the past history of negligent and corrupt safety inspections.
This disaster is the direct result of a serial list of people who either were not self-accountable to their responsibilities or were not held accountable by superiors or other proper authorities.
Does anyone know what toxins are in that drilling mud? With all the toxic oil, gas, and dispersants I was just wondering what other toxins they are gushing into the ocean. I just hope it freaking works.
From Countdown last night, it would seem to be a clay and water mixture, tho there are other types -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drilling_fluid
If the drilling fluid is anything like the fracking fluid used for natural gas production, look out: http://blogs.wvgazette.com/watchdog/2009/10/02/what-caused-big-fracking-fluid-spill-in-doddridge-county/
It either makes me so angry to see the "natural gas is the answer" adverts on the tee vee, or makes me want to throw up, can't quite decide.
I read about I think it was three different ones Tomm. I was wondering which they were using. Thanks though
Might be a liberal. It infuriates me what these companies do. I grew up in a town called Miamisburg Ohio. We had a really big nuke plant called Monsanto. Later called the Mound plant due to the indian mound across the street. Seemed more friendly I guess. That plant contaminated a large majority of the city. There was plutonium leaks, and tritium leaks, and they would lie and tell you everything is fine.
When they finally shut down that plant they poured cement in the swimming pool I used to go to, and planted grass over it because it was contaminated. There was a park they said was contaminated, but not to worry if you didn't eat any dirt you would be okay. I'm thinking I probably ate some dirt as a kid. The leaves on the trees near the river are all deformed on the trees to this day. They gave them a bunch of money from a super fund, and buried what they could, but it will be many lifetimes before that crap is gone. There was high incidents of cancer near the plant they denied was caused by it.
So the other night on the show they were talking about nuclear energy, and how it was safe and cheaper. I know our plant was a bomb making plant, but it required alot of the same components in an energy plant. Not regulated, and unmonitored it can do sooo much damage. One leak and you got big problems. I know the one in Monroe Ohio helped to clean up lake erie, by filtering the water, but growing up around one of these I don't ever want to live near one again. It's a nice old town, but I moved, and I don't think far enough. It's terrible what these companies do then just leave you with the mess, and an oh well not our problem.
so glad someone said it, it's been on my mind since this began
we're getting ready to send people to mars but still relying on safety orange pillow cases stuffed with styrofoam to stop the oil, what in the hell?
Thank you for continuing to cover this. One thing I would like to see more of, though, is commentary from actual SCIENTISTS. Last night, your commentators--while clearly informed--were a correspondent and a congressman. I know Keith had a marine biologist on, but (as a physicist myself) I continue to be surprised at the experts who are not approached.
I hate to admit it, but this is, in many ways, a theoretical as well as an applied science problem. The known pressure and temperature issues alone made me cringe at some of the first attempted fixes--for instance, I was NOT surprised that the "top hat" developed ice clogs and experienced buoyancy problems. Okay, so it may not be obvious, but you (and BP, and the federal government) need to talk to a few physicists--specifically, fluid dynamicists and maybe people who study planetary atmospheres (a weird connection, I know, but the bottom of the ocean probably analogizes best with, say, the lower atmosphere of Jupiter).
It's very clear we can't test any of these proposed solutions, but I'd feel SO much better knowing that someone had done a computer simulation (or even a back-of-the-envelope calculation!) to test the efficacy of what BP is trying. And NO, BP's own scientists don't count; we need independent verification. I also suspect that such experts might provide as-yet unconsidered solutions, or at least complications.
Hope you are able to work this in somehow. Good luck!
Wow, Rockiesfan, you make a lot of sense. I hope someone out there is listening.
Maybe GeekWeek should be extended so the segment could be devoted to your theory!
While I agree the fix to the BP oilpocalypse is an applied science problem, the underlying causes that allowed this spill and others like it to occur are also a public policy problem. I would also genuinely enjoy interviews and commentary from scientists, but I think Rachel is correct to focus on the root cause factors like Government's who allow oil companies to drill without a clear plan or appropriate technology to stop leaks in a worst case scenario.
This was an interesting the-more-things-change-the-more-they-stay-the-same piece, but what I really want to know now is what was the long term environmental impact of the Ixtoc spill? If it's so similar, couldn't some projections on the current spill's effects be extracted from a blast from the past?
That was my question exactly. I live in a red state and there is no point in pointing this out to anyone without some statement about the environmental impact.
Anyone have any idea?
I just talked to a friend who works at BP, and they pointed out the following:
"Since 1979, have you heard of any spills of the same magnitude in shallow water? No. That is beacause they can contain them with the methods they are using and used on the 1979 spill because they perfected them for shallow water. All of the methods mentioned here were used on rigs that were damaged by huricane Katrina."
My friend is right--the general public has not heard about any other shallow water spills. We can interpret this in two ways, either they have not happened, or that they HAVE, but they are contained so successfully that they are non-events. If the latter is true, it is kind of a double edged sword for BP to admit--that they KNOW the technology works in shallow waters, but that they have had LOTS of practice. I don't know how much my friend is involved in drilling operations, but this might be worth following up and issuing a correction if true.
They didn't know how to stop the Ixtoc Oil Spill in 1979 ,which was a shallow oil well and thay don't know how to do it today. Drilling should all be stopped until they have a proven way to prevent the disasters such as Ixtoc 1 and the Horizon Sopill.
I hope you will address the damage from the oil spill, 31 years ago. Fishing, shrimping, life is still abundant in the gulf, even though the oil must have effected the ecosystem in a big way. Can you call this an enormous setback, not the end of life in the gulf? Surely there are fishermen who remember and suffered the consequences but continued to fish again? Or did they leave?
The excessive drama and weekly Katrina-for-Obama moments keep people in an emotional frenzy but do not assist in dealing with the real world, full of real human tragedy. And, OMG, don't we always continue to be heart-breakingly human?
LOVE what you're doing. Your show is the news. Thanks!
I had written the networks and CNN and MSNBC about this Ixtoc disaster weeks ago and finally I seem to have gotten response from Rachel Maddow. Why did it take so long. The networks only mentioned over and obver about the Exxon Valdez which was a thimble of oil compared to Ixtoc1. Why?
It's nice to know that some things never change and we still don't learn from our mistakes!
All top BP brass need to work for one month [6 days a week, 8 hours a day] in those white jump suits with shovels during July & Ausust along the Gulf beaches scooping up oil. This is the only way they will learn the "Real Life" that is going on. It will let the punishment fit the crime.
NYT's article on crocs store opening in Soho. Only sells crocs made of "resin." But does anyone recognize what the resin is made of? (just say foamed oil) I think the lack of understanding of our interdependence on oil is tragic. We need it to change but if we don't know it's ubiquitous in our daily lives, and we yell for magic change - might as well be magic beans in a folktale.
Dear Rachel
Great great show last night. You are the only one who dug up this historical horrible oil spill right now. If the spill lasted 9 months, I would like to know when the shrimping and fishing resumed after the disaster in 1979. Evidently, the fishermen and government were not concerned about the long term health effect and they have been feeding us as if there were nothing wrong. All the fisherman who claimed that they had been in the business for several generations, they must remember the spill in 1979, but they haven't said a word about it. Why?? It is obvious that they don't want to down play this GP spill damages and receive all the compensation they can. (and I think they should) But, they can't go in both way : If the environment was damaged so much by the spill in 1979, they shouldn't have been fishing at all, but they have been.
It is so interesting that your excellent Rand Paul interview was covered all over the following morning, day and night. But, nobody is covering your report on this historical spill this morning. I think you will get pressured to shut up, but please don't. Please reveal more facts. That's only thing I want to hear and need to hear.... well a couple of more new cocktail recipes are welcome, though.
GEE, 31 years to have a backup plan for worst case oil disasters. The United States can put a man on the moon in the 60's. But science can't come up or won't come up with a solution for deep oil spells. They have had plenty of time to have the best way to figure out what to do. NO excuses. BP you spend your money on making more money. Forget about seeing into the future, make the money NOW! We will pass the bill off to the consumer with higher gas prices. VERY MAD! JS
I hope President Obama is more open minded about other countries wanting to come in and help. I watched his speech today, and it was pretty lame, don't have much hope after his speech today! (JS)
I think I'm going to mail BP/Tony Haward an envelope filled with soot and a note asking whether his plans to clean it will involve somebody else to coming in to remove it or himself making the particles even smaller and spreading it out over the whole room and just let nature take care of it from there.
I bet he's got a a really, really expensive rug at his mansion. He lives near Sevenoaks and according to Wikipedia enjoys insemenating his animal stock himself, so I guess he is a DIY sort of guy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Hayward#Personal_life (I swear, I found it like that.)
I love Rachel and what she said . I agree.
Interesting. Not one bit of criticism as to how the administration is handling this man-made disaster. Double standard vs. Katrina?
Somebody somewhere said; 'not Obama's Katrina, but Obama'a Chernobyl' ... made sense to me ... a natural disaster vs. a human one.
Katina highlighted many failures of our society, but was pushed into that by an event beyond our control.
Oil exploration, safety, and retrieval is in our control, or should be.
Anyone else note Transocean's sadly ironic tag line on their web site?
You can find it here: http://www.deepwater.com/fw/main/Global-Operations-8.html
Surprised they didn't have that expunged from their site soon after the Deepwater Horizon went down.
What I don't understand is why no one seems to care about the 11 dead. Why have we not seen their names and pictures and heard from their families? We need to see who they are. They lost their lives because of greed and no one has been charged. In Canada, and most other first world countries, the CEO and Directors would already have criminal charges against them, with possible life sentences. Lives mean more than money, except in third world countries.
Hi, Rachel! I was utterly astounded last night to see your segment about the Bay Of Campeche blowout of '79. Why? Because either "you copied meeeee!" (to be said in whiny voice) or we had a Vulcan Mind Meld (and I'm not even a Star Trek fan). Yesterday afternoon, I posted about that very event (and how there is still NO SOLUTION), in reply to a story on HuffPo about Sen. Bill Nelson saying the military should be called in. As I asked, what are they going to do, throw a tank in the water & hope it hits the wellhead?
Here's the link to my post (sort of - it's actually a few above me) if you're at all curious (I'm Katzencats) : http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/26/bill-nelson-obama-should_n_590291.html?show_comment_id=48448158#comment_48448158
I want to thank you & your staff for your investigations & excellence in journalism. I have to gush for a moment & admit I think of you as Murphy Maddow. When Diane English described the Murphy Brown character, she called her Mike Wallace In A Dress. That's how I think of you & your reporting, even if you're wearing trousers. Thanks.
I saw this clip on Youtube and was also shocked that she used "white guy" with an obvious racist slant. For all those disagreeing, think about this. If she was white and said "black guy"... everyone would have been all over her.
Why are racially specific comments against Caucasians OK?
Great story comparing this oil spill to the one in 1979. Even though some posting here seem to have heard this story, I had not and I expect many others have not either. My guess is because it affected Mexico more than it did America's shorelines, so doesn't "count" quite the same.
The transition of the United States Coast Guard to the BP Oilpocalypse Coast Guard is no surprise to me. I am a Riverkeeper and extensively worked the Tennessee Valley Authority's gigantic 1.1 billion gallon coal ash spill into the Emory River in Harriman, Tennessee. I have returned to the coal ash spill disaster site with a research team from Appalachian State University and the Tennessee Aquarium Research Institute six times since it occurred in December of 2008 after the TVA dam catastrophically failed, unleashing the 10 foot tall tidal wave of ash. Here is a link to just one of the videos I made of our research trips. It shows you what 1.1 billion gallons of heavy metal laden coal ash looks like when it clogs a river.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwcQPf_9fc
At TVA's behest, the Coast Guard initially closed a 4 mile stretch of the Emory River, then later increased the closed portion to six miles. The closure of the Emory River lasted for months on end, even though the area impacted by spilled ash was less than a mile long.
Like BP, TVA aggressively sought to control access, documentation and independent testing of its toxic pollution and the resulting environmental impact on public waters of the Unites States. Increasingly over time in the two years since the spill, the Coast Guard became more and more of a handmaiden to TVA.
With the BP spill they are just continuing an emerging pattern of caring more about the polluters interest than the public interest. If our past experience with the US Coast Guard and the TVA coal ash disaster is prelude to what we might expect from the Coast Guard with respect to the BP oilpocalypse, then expect an ever increasing choke hold on access and independent research/reporting from ground zero of the oil spill.
The Gulf of Mexico is a public waterway of the United States of America. It is a public trust asset that belongs to the people not the polluters. Denying journalists, photographers, videographers and researchers access to the areas impacted by the oil spill denies them the capacity tell the public the story of what is happening to our beloved Gulf Coast. This is wrong on multiple levels. I hope that journalists, the institutions and/or companies they work for will strongly fight this emerging trend to silence truth.
Having spent my life on waterways all over the United States, I have a great deal of experience, admiration and respect for the US Coast Guard. They save lives and work hard to ensure the safety of our waterways and ports. However, I am deeply concerned and disappointed by their increasing level of collusion with polluters whose reckless disregard for the safety of people and the environment have unleashed massive spills into public waterways. I am hopeful that the US Coast Guard will carefully examine this trend, reverse it and get back to putting the public interest over the polluters interest.
Keep hitting hard on this 'that was then, this is then' ... deja vu ... story. Pictures can be worth thousands of words.
The fact that we have not learned much in all these years, considering the critical nature of the oil industry, seems criminal. Criminals are supposed to be brought to justice in this nation. I will look forward to that.
Why is nobody else covering this story?